Junkyard Sherman |

Lance
M4

Posts: 45

Junkyard Sherman Apr 19, 2017 3:52:54 GMT -5

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Post by Lance on Apr 19, 2017 3:52:54 GMT -5

Decided on a fun project to get my modelling mojo back. I'm using bits and pieces from my spares box to build an early M4A1 produced by PSC.

The lower hull comes from Tamiya's venerable M4. The Tamiya upper hull is a mish-mash of features from a variety of Shermans along with some pretty basic inaccuracies so I trashed it. What the Tamiya kit does have going for it is that the basic dimensions are pretty good and the three piece transmission is OK.

There are some interesting 'features' with Tamiya's lower hull such as bogey mounting plates that vary in height on each side. Not a such a problem with Tamiya's own bogies but a PITA if you want to use another makers parts like I did. I sanded these off and replaced them with Dragon plates that matched the Dragon Bogies I wanted to use. I experimented with a DIY detail sander for the removal job and I was pleasantly surprised with the speed and efficiency at which this dealt with the task. The vibrating motion did not generate enough heat to cause any problems either. Bonus!

Below is a shot of the sander I used to remove the kit bogey mounting plates

Tamiya's idler mounts are simply horrible. I removed them and installed spare Asuka parts for a much better look

Before and after, bottoms up.

I used the Tamiya transmission seen here before final cleanup

Last Edit: Apr 20, 2017 3:11:12 GMT -5 by Lance - Back to Top

beekster
M4A1

Posts: 347

Junkyard Sherman Apr 19, 2017 10:01:50 GMT -5

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Post by beekster on Apr 19, 2017 10:01:50 GMT -5

Excellent start on a dodgy old kit, Lance! I take it "Junkyard Sherman" refers to the parts-bin nature of the build? Or will the model itself represent an abandoned tank in some storage yard? Cool either way. The use of the detail sander is most interesting, too. I usually use a Dremel at low speed, but still have to watch carefully for overheated plastic. I think I'll take a look for that little Ryobi tool the next time I'm at Home Depot.

"You could probably use some armor. A Sherman can give you a very nice...edge!"

Lance
M4

Posts: 45

Junkyard Sherman Apr 19, 2017 20:55:16 GMT -5

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Post by Lance on Apr 19, 2017 20:55:16 GMT -5

'Junkyard' refers to the fact that all the parts for this project will come from my spares box.

As for the sander, most power tool brands will have a detail sander similar to mine in their range that should work just the same. My tool came with a variety of grades of sandpaper to choose from and I picked one of the finer grades for this job. After the heavy work was done I finished off by hand with a light sand using wet or dry sandpaper

beekster
M4A1

Posts: 347

Junkyard Sherman Apr 19, 2017 22:17:14 GMT -5

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Post by beekster on Apr 19, 2017 22:17:14 GMT -5

Yeah; probably plenty of brands to choose from. But Home Depot is close by, and I've already got a Ryobi string trimmer I'm happy with, so I'm predisposed to them, I guess. Whose upper hull are you using? Tasca/Asuka is wonderful, of course. Dragon's has a problem though; it's too wide by about .080". Somewhere I've got a reference about fixing that; the modeler used thick styrene sheet and dental resin to add material inside the hull shell and then sanded down the original sides to reveal the new ones. I'll see about finding that tomorrow, in case you would find it useful.

"You could probably use some armor. A Sherman can give you a very nice...edge!"

Lance
M4

Posts: 45

Junkyard Sherman Apr 20, 2017 3:06:18 GMT -5 Lance likes this

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Post by Lance on Apr 20, 2017 3:06:18 GMT -5

I know what you mean about Dragon’s over-width hulls. The M4A1 76 also features a curved transition between the hull rear and bottom plate which is inaccurate for that variant. Paul Budzik has a web site which has a number of tweaks for Dragon’s Shermans and he has one section on fixing the hull in the manner you described. I’m thinking my sander with coarse paper would make quick work of the basic re-shaping. The same problem is also present on their old M4A1 75mm kit.

For this build I am using the Asuka mid production hull. I have bought a number of sprues from Asuka’s online shop including a couple of these upper hulls. This is almost a drop fit on Tamiya’s lower hull which required very little work to make the parts work together. The engine deck is Tamiya’s this is not 100% perfect fit but is so close that it doesn’t really matter. Here are a few pics of the work I did to mate the upper and lower hulls.

Last Edit: Apr 20, 2017 3:07:40 GMT -5 by Lance - Back to Top

beekster
M4A1

Posts: 347

Junkyard Sherman Apr 20, 2017 7:54:13 GMT -5

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Post by beekster on Apr 20, 2017 7:54:13 GMT -5

I'm sure it was Budzik's fix I was thinking of last night. But with the Tasca hull, you're good to go. I use their sprue service too, and it is usually excellent though my most recent order took five weeks to arrive. I see one artistic benefit of cross-kitting in these images: There's a small gap where the diff cover meets the hull casting. That joint is always sharp and clean on a Tasca/Asuka build, but the fit on the real tanks varied a bit because the castings had an acceptable variation in how they were machined. And I'm surprised to see how well the Tamiya engine deck fits.

"You could probably use some armor. A Sherman can give you a very nice...edge!"

Mark Aldrich
M4

Posts: 63

Junkyard Sherman Apr 20, 2017 8:41:59 GMT -5

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Post by Mark Aldrich on Apr 20, 2017 8:41:59 GMT -5

Nice work so far. Most of my IDF builds are spares kits. I use Tasca and Tamiya USA and until I ordered the M51 sprue have never been wronged. It wasn't Tamiya's fault. I just had no idea who's turret DEF copied and there is a HUGE size difference between the Dragon and Tamiya cupola. Can't wait to see more. Hope to post some pics of my current progress this weekend.

Last Edit: Apr 20, 2017 8:44:38 GMT -5 by Mark Aldrich - Back to Top

TreadHead is NOT a dirty word

Cry Havoc and let Slip the Dogs of War

Lance
M4

Posts: 45

Junkyard Sherman Apr 20, 2017 20:08:18 GMT -5

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Post by Lance on Apr 20, 2017 20:08:18 GMT -5

I think I saw recently that The DEF turret is based on an old (pre-Tarawa) Dragon kit which means a number of shapes and contours may be a bit off. That's annoying when you pay good money for aftermarket parts.

Here are a few shots of the suspension parts I'm using on his build. The bogeys are Dragon which are pretty nice provided you don't need full articulation. The skids are old Formations items I had lying around. I drilled out the holes in the front of the suspension body and added a few bolts that I punched out of scrap styrene. A couple of Meng bolt heads were used for the spring tensioning set screws. All the axles have been reduced to stubs so I can paint he wheels separately before final assembly.

These photos indicate the need for a bit more cleanup work before I'm done

Here's the full range of running gear. Sprockets and idlers are from Asuka

Lance
M4

Posts: 45

Junkyard Sherman Apr 30, 2017 0:49:11 GMT -5

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Post by Lance on Apr 30, 2017 0:49:11 GMT -5

Here is the start of the work on the Dragon turret I'm using for this build. The turret is generally pretty nice but the ring is smaller than the one on the Asuka hull. I added packers from scrap styrene on the outside of the Dragon ring to firmly locate the turret in the hull.

I replaced the Dragon ventilator with a bit carved off a Tamiya kit. The turret MG and Periscope covers are from Asuka. The covers will match the Asuka hatch I'm going to use

beekster
M4A1

Posts: 347

Junkyard Sherman Apr 30, 2017 8:25:16 GMT -5

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Post by beekster on Apr 30, 2017 8:25:16 GMT -5

Keep up the good work! I forgot to ask earlier...are you going to add the engine access plate on the bottom? It will be visible from low viewing angles. I've got several hulls in the stash and would be happy to measure one up and tell you the number of bolt heads.

"You could probably use some armor. A Sherman can give you a very nice...edge!"

Lance
M4

Posts: 45

Junkyard Sherman Apr 30, 2017 19:19:34 GMT -5

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Post by Lance on Apr 30, 2017 19:19:34 GMT -5

You raise a good point! I'm keeping my options open at the moment and I still haven't decided on a base yet. If I mount it on a base with an upward slope there will be no point but otherwise I probably will add one.

If I do decide to add the access plate I'll just copy the number of bolts on an Asuka M4 but thanks for the offer.

Lance
M4

Posts: 45

Junkyard Sherman Jun 29, 2017 4:01:02 GMT -5

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Post by Lance on Jun 29, 2017 4:01:02 GMT -5

I've been plugging away at this in the odd bit of spare time I've managed to find lately. Most of the hull detailing is done now. I used Greenstuff to help secure the brush guards but overdid it a bit and had to carve away some of the bulk once it had hardened. This caused some of the scratches in the texturing evident in the photos. No big deal I'll touch these up before the paint goes on.

The front brush guards are Voyager while the rear ones were made from scrap PE runners. I like the Voyager parts as they have 'pins' that can be inserted into pre-drilled holes which is a far easier proposition than trying to glue most of the PE offerings from other makers directly onto the surface. The separate side braces mean that the set will work regardless of the glacis angle. The retaining chains are cut from a Hauler fret. I added a cable from lead wire to the siren. The drivers hatch will be fitted in the open position so I added a few extra details to it while the other hatch received only a little work on the exterior.

beekster
M4A1

Posts: 347

Junkyard Sherman Jun 29, 2017 8:26:58 GMT -5

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Post by beekster on Jun 29, 2017 8:26:58 GMT -5

Nice work, Lance, especially the hatch detailing! I noticed that you've chosen a non-standard arrangement of the pioneer tools; are you working from a photo with that configuration or assuming a crew or unit level modification?

Greg

"You could probably use some armor. A Sherman can give you a very nice...edge!"

Lance
M4

Posts: 45

Junkyard Sherman Jun 30, 2017 3:40:00 GMT -5

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Post by Lance on Jun 30, 2017 3:40:00 GMT -5

I'd love to say I'm working from a photo but alas any imperfections are the result of a hurried job plus a desire to use up my remaining stash of Formations tools. These tools are a great time saver, but don't don't necessarily cover all bases when it comes to tool arrangements.

I know the crank handle is way too far left for a stock PSC Sherman (or any M4A1 for that matter) but my fear is that I'll destroy it if I try to move it. I did manage find a couple of photos that kind of supported this but really I was trying to keep things standard so any resemblance to real life is accidental. Maybe I'll try a brand new razor saw blade which should minimise the risk of removing it.

The right rear tool layout is not perfect either but on this build which I am trying to tell myself is just for fun I can live with that. I've still got plenty more unbuilt kits to achieve an improved result on in the stash.

Mark Aldrich M4 Posts: 63	Junkyard Sherman Jun 30, 2017 8:07:23 GMT -5 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by Mark Aldrich on Jun 30, 2017 8:07:23 GMT -5 Most excellent work!
	TreadHead is NOT a dirty word Cry Havoc and let Slip the Dogs of War

beekster
M4A1

Posts: 347

Junkyard Sherman Jun 30, 2017 8:20:17 GMT -5

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Post by beekster on Jun 30, 2017 8:20:17 GMT -5

Lance, you can always assume that Oddball's platoon from Kelly's Heroes was just part of a company of oddly-configured Shermans, and then your tool stowage will fit right in!

I do like the Formations tools, and have a couple of sets still in inventory. I just got some from TMD along with my cable clamps, but I don't have them assigned to a project yet. I think the TMD resin is a more flexible variety than what Formations uses. The Formations formulation is great for hulls and other large, rigid components, but it can be brittle for small things like tools.

Last Edit: Jun 30, 2017 20:52:33 GMT -5 by beekster: grammar - Back to Top

"You could probably use some armor. A Sherman can give you a very nice...edge!"

Lance
M4

Posts: 45

Junkyard Sherman Jun 30, 2017 20:10:26 GMT -5

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Post by Lance on Jun 30, 2017 20:10:26 GMT -5

Talking abot TMD, I've got a set of the newish TMD tools with straps for a future project. Seemed like a good idea at the time as the footman loop renderings on the Formations ones can be a bit indistinct. The thing is now I have to figure how to work in my own footman loops as they would pass through the straps in real life. I'd be interested in seeing different approaches. I think the punched disk and stretched sprue option may work but it is not as convincing as real wire loops.

Back to the project……

Here's a small update on the turret. The Tamiya Extractor fan has weld beads added from Greenstuff epoxy putty. I've also done a few tweaks to the Asuka Cupola.

I have managed to get the crank handle off the rear hull on one piece. It has been relocated and the glue is drying as I write. I'll be touching up the texturing and priming all the PE next. It's a wet weekend here with the silver lining of more bench time due to not being able to do any outdoor chores. Good times!

Last Edit: Jun 30, 2017 20:10:59 GMT -5 by Lance - Back to Top

beekster
M4A1

Posts: 347

Junkyard Sherman Jun 30, 2017 20:56:52 GMT -5

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Post by beekster on Jun 30, 2017 20:56:52 GMT -5

That's right, you're sliding into winter on your side of the world. We're just beginning summer here in the Pacific Northwest, and yard work has already kept us busy several weekends running. Just this afternoon we borrowed my Dad's old Mazda pickup truck, since my wife has plans to raid a couple of plant nurseries tomorrow morning. My job is twofold: Drive the truck, and subsequently dig the holes where I am told to dig. At least the end result is prettier than expending similar effort on a slit trench in the field...

"You could probably use some armor. A Sherman can give you a very nice...edge!"

Lance
M4

Posts: 45

Junkyard Sherman Jul 15, 2017 19:07:35 GMT -5

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Post by Lance on Jul 15, 2017 19:07:35 GMT -5

Modelling time has been scarce lately but I have squeezed in a bit of bench time here and there. Basic construction is almost done now. I've added headlights from Formations spares. I added some detail to the bases of these but to be honest it is almost invisible once they were mounted.

I've also added a few tweaks to Asuka's .50 cal. I added retaining pins with associated chains to the gun mount and added some extra details to the ammo box using photos as a guide. The barrel changing handle snapped off and fell victim to the ravenous carpet monster. I will replace this but I think I'll leave it until the bitter end so the replacement doesn’t suffer the same fate.

dogfish7 M4A1 So many Shermans ..... so little time Posts: 442	Junkyard Sherman Jul 16, 2017 13:45:50 GMT -5 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by dogfish7 on Jul 16, 2017 13:45:50 GMT -5 Some fantastic detail work here.
	Bruce

Lance
M4

Posts: 45

Junkyard Sherman Dec 1, 2017 18:11:46 GMT -5

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Post by Lance on Dec 1, 2017 18:11:46 GMT -5

Here are a few shots of the finished Article. The model was finished as being from The 2nd Platoon, C Company, 13th Armored Regiment Anzio 1944. This unit had paint schemes that were a nice departure from plain O/D. In this case we have a red brown over the basic O/D complemented by some white counter-shading under the bow and gun barrel

Last Edit: Dec 1, 2017 20:15:27 GMT -5 by Lance - Back to Top

dogfish7 M4A1 So many Shermans ..... so little time Posts: 442	Junkyard Sherman Dec 1, 2017 18:27:01 GMT -5 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by dogfish7 on Dec 1, 2017 18:27:01 GMT -5 Sure is some fine finish work, Lance.
	Last Edit: Dec 18, 2017 8:06:12 GMT -5 by dogfish7 - Back to Top Bruce

beekster M4A1 Posts: 347	Junkyard Sherman Dec 17, 2017 21:26:38 GMT -5 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by beekster on Dec 17, 2017 21:26:38 GMT -5 Splendid work, Lance! That camo is rarely modelled; I have it in mind for an eventual Pacific theater tank for the outfit attached to Oregon's own 41st Sunset division.
	"You could probably use some armor. A Sherman can give you a very nice...edge!"

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Junkyard Sherman

Post by Lance on Apr 19, 2017 3:52:54 GMT -5

Post by beekster on Apr 19, 2017 10:01:50 GMT -5

Post by Lance on Apr 19, 2017 20:55:16 GMT -5

Post by beekster on Apr 19, 2017 22:17:14 GMT -5

Post by Lance on Apr 20, 2017 3:06:18 GMT -5

Post by beekster on Apr 20, 2017 7:54:13 GMT -5

Post by Mark Aldrich on Apr 20, 2017 8:41:59 GMT -5

Post by Lance on Apr 20, 2017 20:08:18 GMT -5

Post by Lance on Apr 30, 2017 0:49:11 GMT -5

Post by beekster on Apr 30, 2017 8:25:16 GMT -5

Post by Lance on Apr 30, 2017 19:19:34 GMT -5

Post by Lance on Jun 29, 2017 4:01:02 GMT -5

Post by beekster on Jun 29, 2017 8:26:58 GMT -5

Post by Lance on Jun 30, 2017 3:40:00 GMT -5

Post by Mark Aldrich on Jun 30, 2017 8:07:23 GMT -5

Post by beekster on Jun 30, 2017 8:20:17 GMT -5

Post by Lance on Jun 30, 2017 20:10:26 GMT -5

Post by beekster on Jun 30, 2017 20:56:52 GMT -5

Post by Lance on Jul 15, 2017 19:07:35 GMT -5

Post by dogfish7 on Jul 16, 2017 13:45:50 GMT -5

Post by Lance on Dec 1, 2017 18:11:46 GMT -5

Post by dogfish7 on Dec 1, 2017 18:27:01 GMT -5

Post by beekster on Dec 17, 2017 21:26:38 GMT -5